Help me locate HF radars
in TDoA topics
I have been asked by 60m operators in Europe to help them locate some HF radars, one on 5240 and the other on 5350 kHz. I can't use Kiwi/TDOA myself (doesn't seem to work with Firefox/WinXP) so I am asking for TDoA enthusiasts to help. These radars are about 30kHz wide, emitting a continuous 43Hz pulse. They are NOT Over The Horizon Radars but beam vertically upwards, so they may be difficult to locate. For practice, try the one on 3180 kHz which is at Juliusruh in Germany. The 5240/5350 radars may be in eastern europe.
So far I haven't been able to find any KiWi's with a good enough signal on 5240 & 5350.
The one in Germany is difficult enough even with a good number of KiWi's dotted around the area.
If you want to try for the one in Germany, you can use this URL
The green Tag on the TDoA map below shows the TDoA position.
Martin - G8JNJ
They transmit with approximately the rep rate you describe and look for returns to measure Fcrit and other interesting parameters, while sweeping various portions of the spectrum but, I think, avoiding the ham bands. I have one local to me in Boulder, Colorado which runs about 4 kW and and happen to know the person who operates and maintains it, Terry W0ASP. If it is useful I can probably get more information from him.
I'm not sure I'd be able to pick the correct one out from among that lot.
Martin - G8JNJ
Thanks for your comments. I have studied ionosondes for 20 years, but they always sweep up the spectrum. The one I am hearing now is not one of these. The Digisonde sounders do have what they call a Skymap mode which runs for 2 minutes every 15 minutes on a fixed frequency, but only runs in the daytime since it maps the shape of the (reflecting) ionosphere. This one isn't a digisonde - it seems to be a research device on a fixed frequency. There are two others like it in Western Europe that we know about.
I now have a kludge that enables me to do the TDoA myself with Windows XP and this radar seems to be on the west shore of the Caspian Sea. That would tie in with a previous reference on the KiwiSDR identification ribbon to an OTHR in this location. This one is definitely not an OTHR.
The Khabarovsk signal you found is the same prf as this one, but seems very much wider, unless it's three of them on adjacent channels. There are also some CODAR surface-wave radars around that frequency too. There are plenty of those around Europe. They usually sweep downwards with 1 or 2 sweeps/sec.
With help of Quatar and few other KiwiSDRs yesterday I've been successive to TDoA 60 m radar(s) to Makhachkala, Republic of Dagestan, Russia.
Further Google searching revealed that this might be «Sunflower» radar located in Kaspiysk to Souh from Makhachkala. Here is the Wikimapia object for this radar: wikimapia.org/#lang=en&lat=42.879380&lon=47.670010&z=18&m=bs
It was also noted in IARU R1 November 2013 Monitoring Newsletter Part 1, Section 4: iarums-r1.org/iarums/news2013/news1311.pdf
That's a good catch, I spent quite a lot of time last year looking with Google Earth around the edge of the Caspean Sea trying to find that site.
Well spotted :-)
Martin - G8JNJ